The Marvel cinematic universe has undergone a seismic shift over the years, captivating audiences with its interconnected storylines and well-developed characters. Amid this evolution, Sony Pictures has embarked on a journey to carve its niche with Spider-Man spin-off films that weave a complex web of stories, often diverging from the traditional superhero narrative. One such film is "Kraven the Hunter," a movie that has recently been delayed, sparking discussions about Sony's approach to building its Sinister Six-style spider-verse universe.
The Lukewarm Reception of Kraven the Hunter's Trailer
"Kraven the Hunter," slated as a standalone film in Sony's spider-verse lineup, received a lukewarm response when its trailer dropped. In a conversation between Julian Martinez and Cristian Rogers, they explore the lack of excitement surrounding the movie and express their reservations about its potential success. The trailer seemed to hint at a darker, rated-R take on the character, mirroring the tone of Deadpool. However, both Julian and Cristian are skeptical about whether this approach will be enough to make the movie stand out.
Kraven's Predicament: A Villain in Need of a Foe
One of the fundamental issues raised in the conversation is the challenge of making a villain-centric film work without a strong protagonist to play off. Kraven's character is deeply entwined with Spider-Man's storyline, as he is depicted as a relentless hunter pursuing the elusive hero. Julian and Cristian ponder the absence of Spider-Man in Kraven's solo story and question whether the character can maintain the audience's interest without his iconic adversary.
A Change of Heart for Kraven's Character
The conversation highlights an interesting twist in Kraven's character for the upcoming film. It is mentioned that the film might shift Kraven's focus from hunting animals to hunting humans, perhaps as a means to make the character more relatable and likable. While this change may appeal to certain audiences, it also risks alienating fans who appreciate the character's traditional portrayal as a formidable Big Game hunter.
The Joker Comparison: A Flawed Model for Success
The success of DC's "Joker" movie, which garnered over a billion dollars worldwide, is often cited as a potential blueprint for villain-centric films. However, Julian and Cristian argue that the comparisons between Kraven and Joker are flawed. While Joker boasts a complex and enigmatic character with a rich backstory, Kraven is seen as more one-dimensional. This disparity could impact the movie's ability to capture the audience's attention in a similar manner.
Sony's Tumultuous Journey with Villain-Centric Films
Julian and Cristian discuss Sony's track record with villain-centric movies, referencing the mixed success of films like "Venom" and the critical failure of "Morbius." They question Sony's decision to venture into lesser-known characters' stories, such as Madame Web and an obscure lucha libre wrestler, played by Bad Bunny. Both express doubts about the feasibility of these projects and the potential backlash from audiences.
The Potential for a Symbiote Storyline
Julian and Cristian suggest that Sony should focus on more compelling storylines, such as exploring the various symbiote story arcs. Venom, a more intricate character with an extensive range of storylines, has the potential to maintain a successful movie series. Unlike Kraven or some of the other proposed projects, Venom's multifaceted nature provides ample material for storytelling.
Conclusion: Lessons to Be Learned
In conclusion, Julian and Cristian express their skepticism about Sony's approach to creating a spider-verse universe centered around villains. The conversation showcases their concerns about the lack of a compelling protagonist for Kraven's story, Sony's questionable track record with character-driven movies, and the risk of deviating from well-established character traits. While they acknowledge the success of Spider-verse animated movies and a few Spider-Man films, Julian and Cristian believe that Sony's ambitious endeavors might ultimately fall flat.
The Power of Fan Feedback
This conversation highlights the power of audience feedback and engagement. Fans' reactions can influence studios' decisions and even lead to significant changes in a film's development. Whether it's rallying against a poorly designed character (as seen with Sonic the Hedgehog) or voicing concerns about plot decisions, the Internet's collective voice can reshape the course of a movie's production and release. This phenomenon showcases the growing synergy between filmmakers and their audience in the digital age.
As the cinematic landscape continues to evolve, studios like Sony face both opportunities and challenges in expanding their superhero universes. While the concept of villain-centric movies might offer a fresh perspective, it requires careful execution and a deep understanding of the characters' appeal. As Julian and Cristian discuss, the success of such endeavors rests on a delicate balance of storytelling, character development, and maintaining the essence of what makes these characters iconic in the first place. Only time will tell if Sony can truly spin its web of sinister stories into a compelling cinematic universe.
Unveiling the Spider-Verse Struggles: Can Sony's Villain Movies Stand Alone? 🕷️ Julian and Cristian dive deep into the latest movie delays and the rocky road of Sony's Spider-Verse ambitions. From Kraven the Hunter's questionable solo journey to the ludicrous Aunt May movie idea, they're pulling no punches. Is it time for Sony to focus on their strengths or risk burning through goodwill? Join the debate! #SpiderVerse #KravenTheHunter #SonyMovies"
Julian Martinez: [00:00:13] So just a few weeks after a trailer drops for it. Kraven the Hunter delayed another year. This is not a movie I was particularly excited for. It's not something that like screamed to me, I have to watch this movie. But this does play into what Sony has been trying to do for years in building a sinister six style spider-verse universe. Whatever. Cristian, how you feel about this? I mean, you saw the trailer, too. Did that inspire any hope for this movie actually being good? [00:00:47][34.1]
Cristian Rogers: [00:00:49] The trailer looked alright. You could tell that they're kind of going for like the rated R Deadpool type with this one. I didn't really find it all that great, but I try. I try not to give it hype because of morbius. When when I first saw the Morbius trailer, I was all hyped. I was like, What? Like Morbius is in the Spider-Man universe. This is pretty cool. Like, how are they going to do this? And I kept thinking, like, I wonder if they're I wonder if they're going to try to get like, blade in there and mix it into the MCU. But none of that came true. It was just a horrible movie. So this trailer. I was pretty lukewarm on it. Yeah. [00:01:29][40.2]
Julian Martinez: [00:01:31] I guess for me and this goes into like, I've never understood Sony's philosophy on this one, it's hard for me to have a Spider-Man movie or a movie set in the Spider-Man universe without Spider-Man. Hmm. And that's what they keep trying to do. And I just don't love it, you know? I mean, I know that the Venom movies are very popular. the Venom movies we've seen so far. We know that movie is going to get are that trilogy is going to have its third movie coming up soon. But for the most part, and I think Venom is just a stronger character for the most part, I just don't think that most of these villains can stand on their own without someone to work off of. For Kraven Who's that thing that gets people excited for a kraven movie, right? Like, who's the main threat? Yeah, Craven's the main threat. [00:02:32][61.5]
Cristian Rogers: [00:02:33] Yeah, exactly. Because in the storyline of Kraven, he's always hunting down Spider-Man because Spider-Man is the one thing that he can't catch. So what entity is going to play that in this film? Because in the trailer, all I saw was, okay, Kraven is a hunter, but he's just killing dudes left and right. And it's like, Okay, Bill, Why? Because, you know, every trailer, they don't tell you why, but they give you a little glimpse of where this can go. I didn't. This trailer, I think that's why I'm, like, lukewarm on it, because it's like, okay, what's the purpose of Kraven having his own movie? [00:03:13][39.5]
Julian Martinez: [00:03:14] Why now? I guess one thing you could say to Sony's benefit or giving them the benefit of the doubt in this is that Joker made $1,000,000,000 Joker, you know, So why can't I make a villain movie without that villain's main antagonists or the protagonists of said series? Hmm. I think for that one, the simple answer I have. I think Joker's just a more interesting character and anything. Spider-Man The Spider Man universe can really pump out it for the purposes of a standalone film because Joker has so much like nuance to his character. The fact that we never really know what his backstory is. Kraven is pretty one note as a character, or at least to me, feels like pretty one note. And maybe that's on the movie to kind of change my mind about that, but I just don't see myself listen, I just don't see myself opening night wanting to watch the Kraven movie. I'm not going to put it bluntly. [00:04:22][68.8]
Cristian Rogers: [00:04:24] Yeah. And that's how I kind of felt about the Venom movie when they first came out that trailer, because I kept questioning to like, Why are you going to do a Venom movie without Spider-Man? But they also did other things within that movie that showed, okay, well, this movie doesn't really need Spider-Man. [00:04:42][18.4]
Julian Martinez: [00:04:43] All that much. And Venom is a more interesting character than Kraven takes. I think that's that's the God's honest truth. I mean, and that shows in the comics, because the comics have done so much more to make Venom his own character. The fact that Venom has a standalone comic series, that Venom is, you know, is the antihero to. People. You know, he's not just a villain. Like, is the thing. Like, to me, Craven's just always been a villain. [00:05:14][30.9]
Cristian Rogers: [00:05:15] Yeah, he's just always been a villain. Always like hunting, doing all that. And. [00:05:21][6.0]
Julian Martinez: [00:05:21] And for movie audiences, too, I think movie audiences obviously always need a protagonist. Now, it sounds kind of cheesy to say, but you need someone to root for. Who do you root for in this one? And also, it's kind of like even kind of consider the real life world about it. There's not a lot of people that actually have fond views of hunting nowadays. So I kind of wonder if there's any even be a little bit of pushback to this movie, especially when we consider Craven's a Big Game hunter, which I have no problem with, but I'm sure some people will. [00:05:53][31.2]
Cristian Rogers: [00:05:54] I heard a rumor, though, that they changed this Craven that he doesn't hunt animals. I heard that. [00:06:00][6.4]
Julian Martinez: [00:06:00] So you're just pacifying Craven. You're taking away one of his core aspects as a character, essentially. [00:06:05][4.6]
Cristian Rogers: [00:06:06] So I think that's why in the trailer he's just killing dude left and right. [00:06:09][3.1]
Julian Martinez: [00:06:10] Yeah, because we have to make him more likable because he's killing the quote unquote bad dudes, which if I understand the trailer also are people. They're big game hunting. [00:06:18][8.0]
Cristian Rogers: [00:06:19] Yeah. So I think that's the change that they made. But it to me, it just doesn't sound that great. [00:06:25][5.6]
Julian Martinez: [00:06:26] It's a deviation on that character, a character that works well being that character. [00:06:32][5.4]
Cristian Rogers: [00:06:33] Mm hmm. [00:06:33][0.3]
Julian Martinez: [00:06:34] And hey, credit to Aaron Taylor-Johnson. The dude was fuckin yoked for this movie. [00:06:38][4.0]
Cristian Rogers: [00:06:39] Yeah, and I like that actor a lot. I think he's a good actor. But this movie, I don't think it's going to do that. Great for him, to be honest. [00:06:45][6.3]
Julian Martinez: [00:06:47] No, it just sounds like a movie that's going to do no one any favors. And I also just question in general, like be moving beyond Craven and having this discussion like, can these movies or I guess I should say, because Sony will say, can these movies work while we do the work? Well, other movies coming up. Then we have like Madame Web. I know they want to do a movie about like some obscure lucha libre wrestler played by Bad Bunny, and that's falling through on them. Can they do a Green Goblin movie? Can they Doc Ock movie? I just don't see it. Yeah, yeah. Just be a natural foil there. And if you're the thing that tethers the universe together, if it's not in there, it feels weird. And you know, the more I'll bring up morbius, you know, like if you want bring up your successes, then I can just bring up your biggest failure. It's Morbius. [00:07:41][54.2]
Cristian Rogers: [00:07:43] Morbius said. I saw. I've yet to see that movie. [00:07:44][1.8]
Julian Martinez: [00:07:45] Good. No one should. No one should shout to the rooftops. It's Morbin time. [00:07:51][5.7]
Cristian Rogers: [00:07:54] So bad movie. Yeah. Okay. So Sony itself. I try. Okay. So I love the Spider-verse movies. They've been killing it with Spider-Man. I liked. I like "Venom." I liked the "Let There Be Carnage." I thought that was a fun movie. But other than that, dude, I just don't. I don't like their plans with the villains. Like. [00:08:21][26.4]
Julian Martinez: [00:08:21] It's safe to say. Yeah. Is it just safe to say they've just burned their goodwill with us? Because they. We talk about the failures all the time. "Spider-Man 3." [00:08:32][10.2]
Cristian Rogers: [00:08:33] Mm hmm. [00:08:33][0.1]
Julian Martinez: [00:08:34] Then you go into the amazing Spider-verse, and I know you like them more than I like them. I didn't love those movies to begin with, but the amazing Spider-verse is amazing. Spider-Man two was awful. And yeah, I'm not trying to diminish Spider-verse when I say this, but at the end of the day it is animated movie, which I do feel gives you more liberties and things, ability to do stuff creatively like they've done when it comes to live action movies like they're releasing here, like Kraven, their track record I don't think really justifies it. [00:09:11][37.1]
Cristian Rogers: [00:09:13] Yeah. And dude, I have like no faith in the "Madame Web" movie. I just I don't I don't see how they can do it. Like, I don't know. I don't see it like when they announced that there there was like a big question mark on my face, like how and I want to. [00:09:32][19.6]
Julian Martinez: [00:09:33] Tell you how ridiculous it got at one point and this was during the Amazing Spider-Man era with Andrew. [00:09:39][6.1]
Cristian Rogers: [00:09:39] Bolt you're going to bring up. [00:09:40][1.3]
Julian Martinez: [00:09:41] They wanted to do Aunt May movie. [00:09:44][2.6]
Cristian Rogers: [00:09:46] But yeah, yeah, I remember that. [00:09:49][3.2]
Julian Martinez: [00:09:49] Like that tells you how ridiculous that at one point Sony got with it. And I think Marvel kind of reigned them in a little bit, like on doing that stuff when they finally got the Tom Holland deal done. But since they got that money, that financial boost and a little bit more good equity with Spider-Man properties. I think that they have decided to take it to the next extreme and again, go back to doing what they wanted to do from the beginning and just squeezing every last drop of money they can from this like universe that just isn't that deep. It's just not a deep roster. I feel. [00:10:26][36.4]
Cristian Rogers: [00:10:26] Yeah. Yeah. Is like venom. Like venom himself. You said it like we both agree is he's a very more interesting character. With him, there's been so many storylines that they could keep the Venom movies going on forever. [00:10:43][16.2]
Julian Martinez: [00:10:44] And okay, let me also just say what? The Venom movies. Yes. People like them. Yes, they made money, but those Venom movies are not exactly taking home any Academy Awards. [00:10:56][12.2]
Cristian Rogers: [00:10:58] Hmm. [00:10:58][0.0]
Julian Martinez: [00:11:00] Is that fair to say? Like they're not going to be critically acclaimed movies in the same way that at one point Marvel was and even some occasional hits from DC, like. Yeah, they're they're mostly people have fun with them more than they're good movies. [00:11:14][14.8]
Cristian Rogers: [00:11:16] Yeah, that's true. Like, that's very true. Dude, you only got that at any movie. Do what? They announced that I kept thinking, like, are they going to get Nicholas Sparks to write this shit, or does it go romantic? [00:11:31][14.9]
Julian Martinez: [00:11:32] Like, it's so dumb? Like, whoever pitched that, Like, I hope that they don't have a job anymore. [00:11:38][5.3]
Cristian Rogers: [00:11:39] Like, will you ever? [00:11:42][2.9]
Julian Martinez: [00:11:42] Why are you insulting your. Who are who? Watch. It is the biggest question I have. Oh, yeah. I want to watch the Aunt May movie that doesn't have Spider-Man and focuses on Mae and her struggles in this universe. [00:11:55][12.9]
Cristian Rogers: [00:11:59] Hoo hoo. Remember that? [00:12:00][1.8]
Julian Martinez: [00:12:01] It's like an insult to, like, the intelligence of moviegoing audiences. It's just like, Oh, they'll just pay for anything if it's comic book related. [00:12:08][7.1]
Cristian Rogers: [00:12:11] Yeah, for real though. Yeah, they did think that back in the day. And then Marvel came out swinging and was like, Oh yeah, they won't. [00:12:18][7.2]
Julian Martinez: [00:12:20] Yeah. Kevin Feige stepped in there is like the fuck you will, you know, like on. Like, what are we doing here? [00:12:29][9.8]
Cristian Rogers: [00:12:30] Yeah, exactly. I did feel kind of like that with the Madame Web movie. Not gonna lie like I was just like, Why? [00:12:37][6.9]
Julian Martinez: [00:12:39] What are we doing here, guys? Come on, Sony, be better. Just focus on your strengths. You have Spider-Man, focus on the strenghts. In fact, you're lucky right now. You have potentially three Spider-Man to pull from at the moment. Make those sequels. If they work, then we can start talking and build Sinister Six within those Spider-Man's universes. But don't try to stop with this nonsense of trying to make the Sinister Six happen. Outside of Spider-Man's main continuity. I feel like giving them the mean girls talk. Stop trying to make the Sinister Six universe happen. It's not going to happen. That's how I feel about it. [00:13:19][40.1]
Cristian Rogers: [00:13:20] Yeah. Honestly, if I was Sony, I'd go for like the symbiote storylines. That's what I would be doing. [00:13:27][7.1]
Julian Martinez: [00:13:27] I was like protesting these movies mostly on principle. [00:13:30][2.3]
Cristian Rogers: [00:13:31] Yeah, it just doesn't make sense. Morbius was the one that made me question like all this. Like, why? Like, why are you doing this? [00:13:38][7.5]
Julian Martinez: [00:13:41] God, I watched the movie. You can't even really tie that. I watch that movie out of waste 2 hours of my life I spent on a matinee to watch. [00:13:50][8.9]
Cristian Rogers: [00:13:50] Morbius you spent money on? [00:13:51][1.6]
Julian Martinez: [00:13:53] I went to a matinee movie, so I got a discount. You know, normal, just chill, run of the mill day. And I still felt like I wanted my money back. That's how bad that movie was. [00:14:03][10.2]
Cristian Rogers: [00:14:03] I remember when Sony thought that people wanted it to be released in theaters again because of all the news, and they did. [00:14:10][6.4]
Julian Martinez: [00:14:12] The expert trolling that went into that to convince a studio that's already released a bad movie to try and rerelease it. Actually, I really hope that 20 years from now that it's Morbin time movement restarts and Sony tries to get killed. It's like 20 year anniversary. It's Morbin time. [00:14:36][23.7]
Cristian Rogers: [00:14:37] To do that. I thought that was so funny. That was that was ridiculous. That was hilarious. [00:14:43][5.1]
Julian Martinez: [00:14:44] It reminds me almost when we bullied once that I think paramount to change Sonic the Hedgehog, that's the Internet is powerful. [00:14:52][8.1]
Cristian Rogers: [00:14:53] That's very powerful. Good. [00:14:54][0.9]
Julian Martinez: [00:14:55] All right, guys. All right. Well, hey, maybe we're wrong. Are you excited for Kraven the hunter? Let us know. We'll question your excitement, but let. us know in the comment section. Leave it like on the video. Subscribe to the channel. Follow us on our social media channels from Julian Cristian. Stay safe, happy and healthy. We'll see you next time. [00:14:55][0.0]