Baker Mayfield Struggles as Kyle Trask Challenges for Bucs Starting Job

Julian Martinez: [00:00:05] The Baker Mayfield saga continues in Tampa Bay. But for how long? Baker Mayfield Seven interceptions in training camp so far. Many are wondering, with this potentially being Baker's last chance if he doesn't win the starting job over Kyle Trask, is he done. [00:00:21][16.7]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:00:22] Done as in being a starting quarterback in the NFL? [00:00:24][2.4]
Julian Martinez: [00:00:25] Done as and being a starting quarterback in the NFL for sure. But do you think that this is just his last year? Like, even if he's the backup, like, okay, he sits on Tampa's bench for a year. Is that it? Like, can Baker Mayfield walk into the sunset after that? [00:00:39][14.2]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:00:41] Still, I can't remember if it was you and I talking about it or someone else. But last year, when the whole Rams thing was going on with Baker Mayfield, he was having this career revival and an incredible 13 point comeback on Thursday Night Football for the Rams. I remember saying at the time, Baker Mayfield is one of those quarterbacks where he's going to have to reinvent himself to have a second stage of his career, because it's pretty clear Baker Mayfield's no longer the starting quarterback in the NFL. Basically, the way that came about is really sad, where his former team, Cleveland, basically didn't sign him to an extension going into his fourth season because they didn't sign him to an extension his fourth season. He played through just a ridiculous amount of injuries. He had two knee injuries, a torn throwing shoulder, an elbow injury, an ankle injury. He had a bruised rib that year. Like Baker, Mayfield was just absolutely gutting it out for a team that had no chance of making the playoffs and a team that plan try to move on from him at the end of the season because any ability Baker Mayfield showed his first year or that third year where they made the playoffs and won a playoff game against Pittsburgh, they grinded it out of him. Baker Mayfield I mean, it's been known for years. He's a smaller stature quarterback and all that stuff. But the other thing was he was a two time former walk on, which means that you look up and Baker Mayfield is 28 years old and Baker Mayfield being 28 years old means that he's kind of at that age where the guys who don't really have it as a quarterback in the NFL start to see a decline like we've seen for a few years that, like Kirk Cousins was the fully formed quarterback and then a bunch of young quarterbacks replaced him. And then Jimmy Garoppolo became a fully forward quarterback and then a bunch of quarterbacks entered the league and he went from like the 15th best quarterback to 25. Andy Dalton went from 15 to 25. That's kind of where Baker Mayfield's out at this point is just teams would rather choose the young guy to replace you, and whether that's Bryce Young with the Carolina Panthers or whether it's Kyle Trask with the Tampa Bay Buccaneers teams have just opted for, we're going to take the young quarterback instead of you. And yeah, Baker Mayfield is is it in what I called a bridgewater-ing stage of his career which is he is just going to be a quarterback hoping that he can get one last big contract before he is no longer able to play the quarterback position at a high level. If this is his last year in the NFL, it's going to be because he is the kind of quarterback who doesn't need to reinvent himself just to stay in the league as a backup. Like he doesn't need to have the underdog, unbridled confidence that he's had for all these years because he's he's accomplished everything he can in the sport. He there's no reason to just keep going on as a backup. Maybe that's what he said. Well, he. [00:03:31][170.4]
Julian Martinez: [00:03:31] Has accomplished everything he can in the sport. I mean, obviously, there's MVP individual honors, There's team honors. He hasn't accomplished. [00:03:39][8.3]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:03:40] That. Yeah. Yeah. No, but he's never going to be able to do that. Right. Like, yes, Philip Rivers never won a championship. And by the time he was 37, there was no chance he was going to win a championship. Like, yeah, Baker Mayfield. That would be like setting the bar, I think too high for Baker Mayfield because again, this is a former two time walk on quarterback who became the greatest quarterback in the history of college football. [00:04:02][22.2]
Julian Martinez: [00:04:03] I think that's. [00:04:03][0.4]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:04:04] Part of the whole. [00:04:04][0.4]
Julian Martinez: [00:04:04] Story, but I think that's part of the problem, right? Baker Mayfield, his expectation, his ego, what he sees in himself is not a Bridgewater quarterback. I mean, the biggest difference between him and a Teddy Bridgewater is Teddy. Bridgewater never really had commercials. Teddy Bridgewater never was like the face of a franchise like I guess Minnesota as the starting quarterback. But if you told me about Teddy Bridgewater being their starting quarterback back in the day like okay like Baker Mayfield if the Cleveland Browns would have went on to have a little bit more success, he would have been like almost as big as LeBron and Cleveland. How he at one point like winning their first playoff game in like 30 years, that still, you know, like he was. [00:04:47][42.3]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:04:47] He was the quarterback that broke the drought. Right. They had like 17 quarterbacks in 15 years. And he was the first one that actually looked like he was worth a damn for that franchise. They grinded him up and tossed him out the door. If you remember last offseason, he was kind of like in limbo for like five months or something where they had already moved on from him, but they weren't ready to just cut him outright. They were waiting for a team that was willing to pay at least a little bit of his $18 million fifth year option. And then Carolina was the team that stepped up and Cleveland paid 12 million and Carolina paid 6 million. And then Baker ended up getting tossed out. But I mean, last two years have been a reality check. [00:05:26][38.8]
Julian Martinez: [00:05:26] Yeah. So you mentioned other quarterbacks. So like dropping from 15 to like 25. Where is Baker Mayfield realistically? You said not a starting quarterback. So is he outside the top 32 in terms of ability like are there 32 guys that you look at and think better than Baker Mayfield? [00:05:39][13.4]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:05:40] He's number 32. I feel like I can say with relative certainty he is the worst starting quarterback going into the season in the NFL. Desmond Ridder is probably pretty close. Sam Howell is pretty close. But those guys are kind of what I think of as the worst starting quarterbacks in the NFL. It's Ridder with the Falcons. It's Howell with Washington, it's Baker Mayfield with Tampa. So I guess that means he's like in the 25 to 26 range. And granted, there's like four rookies who haven't played yet. So I haven't really, like, put them into the list yet just because they're rookies and we don't know what they are yet. But and I think Jordan loves is also in that group. So maybe Jordan Love is also considered a rookie because he hasn't really played yet as a quarterback. So yeah, I'd say Baker's probably not like 25, 26, 27 range. [00:06:27][46.9]
Julian Martinez: [00:06:28] So if you're Tampa, do you have any obligation to start him over? Kyle Trask Because you've seen a lot of Baker Mayfield on tape. We've seen him play a lot of games in the NFL, so we more or less know where Baker Mayfield is. We haven't seen contrast. And I don't know if you're a big Kyle Trask believer or not, but at least we can potentially see it the same way we talk about like a Trey Lance. Like it'd be nice to just kind of like, see what he has on the field as opposed to Baker Mayfield, who we know who he is on the field. Like you're Tampa and you're seeing this training camp right now. Or you think to yourself like, Oh fuck, I don't know if we're going to be bad. He might as well just start the new guy. [00:07:00][32.5]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:07:01] So I'm usually always in favor of start the new guy instead of just the placement holder quarterback. I remember last year I was yelling from the very beginning of training camp until week four. Why the hell are the Steelers playing Mitchell Trubisky? You drafted a quarterback in the first round. He's clearly your long term plan. Please put Kenny Pickett in to start week one of the season and by week four they had made the call They'd seen enough of Trubisky being bad and then they replace Trubisky with Kenny Pickett and haven't looked back since because they are invested in Kenny Pickett's development. The difference with this team is I don't know if Tampa Bay is too invested in Kyle Trask's development because remember they picked him with, I want to say, the last pick in the second round the year after they won the Super Bowl. [00:07:45][44.5]
Julian Martinez: [00:07:46] Different circumstances, though, when you're talking about Tom Brady being on the roster versus Baker Mayfield being on the roster. [00:07:51][5.3]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:07:52] Yeah, but I don't know if they believe Kyle Trask is their quarterback of the future. Now, maybe you say this season is a wash anyways and you give them a chance, but maybe they go into the season believing, hey, if we have good luck with health, if Mike Evans bounces back this season, then maybe, just maybe, we can win the NFC South like we did last year. And I just don't know which quarterback gives you the better option to win. But I also know Tampa Bay isn't invested in Kyle Trask's future because they drafted him to be a backup quarterback. He was a later round pick that didn't really have franchise quarterback potential when they picked him. Meanwhile, the Pittsburgh Steelers, regardless of what you thought about Kenny Pickett going into that draft, the Pittsburgh Steelers made their call. Kenny Pickett is the quarterback we're investing in for the future. We're drafting him in the first round. We're giving him every opportunity to develop. I don't know if Tampa Bay's committed that way to Kyle Trask or Trask is a placeholder for the quarterback they're about to draft in next year's NFL draft. So if Kyle Trask is viewed as a placeholder, the difference between playing Baker and Kyle Trask is kind of regardless if neither is going to be on the roster next season. But if you believe that either of them has a chance to be on the team next year, you play that one. And I don't know which quarterback they think has a better chance of being on the roster next year between Baker Mayfield and Kyle Trask. You play whichever one you think has the best chance to stay on the team and give them the repetitions. [00:09:16][84.7]
Julian Martinez: [00:09:17] I'm pretty sure contrast still has at least a couple more years on that rookie deal, right? [00:09:21][3.9]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:09:22] Yeah, but we've seen rookie, we've seen backup rookie quarterbacks get tossed all the time. I think Kellen Mond just got. [00:09:27][5.2]
Julian Martinez: [00:09:27] Yeah. But if they wanted to keep him as a backup even next year, like let's say they just want to see what he can do on the football field. They could keep him next year because Baker is just on a one year deal, right? [00:09:36][8.6]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:09:36] Yeah, for sure. I think Kyle Trask is 20. He was just drafted the year after they won the Super Bowl. So that would be this is his third year. So he's got one more year after this. Now, so Tampa. [00:09:47][10.6]
Julian Martinez: [00:09:47] Is potentially in a blow up mode, but they can also it's already enough just because of the division they're in. They could also still potentially make the playoffs if the NFC South is just as bad as it was last year. Right. [00:09:58][11.1]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:09:59] Yeah, but that's where the question is interesting is which quarterback does give you the best chance to make the playoffs? Is it Baker Mayfield or is that Kyle Trask? I have no idea. I suspect Tampa has no idea either. So, I mean, I don't think Baker Mayfield or Kyle Trask are like long term plans as an NFL starting quarterback. But I didn't think Geno Smith was last year, so potentially I could be wrong. Maybe Kyle Trask is given the opportunity and he looks like a solid quarterback. [00:10:25][26.0]
Julian Martinez: [00:10:25] Well, the difference is that last year and we didn't believe it when he was saying it, but last year Pete Carroll was saying, Man, it's a nice luxury to feel like you have to starting quarterbacks. When he was asked about the Drew Lock first Geno Smith discussion and then Geno went out there and. Proved what he proved, made a Pro Bowl looked pretty solid and we could kind of see it. But not every headline I'm seeing, at least out of Tampa, is negative press. Baker Mayfield throws another one and throws another one. And I think when you consider the type of player that Baker Mayfield is, I want to say he's thrown the most interceptions since he's entered the league. [00:10:59][33.9]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:11:00] It's something like that. And Baker Mayfield, from what he's telling us, took less money for an opportunity to be a starter in Tampa. I don't know how true that is because I've only heard it come out of Baker Mayfield's mouth, but he is basically saying, I believe I am a starting quarterback in the NFL still, which if you're Baker Mayfield, of course you have to believe that. [00:11:23][23.0]
Julian Martinez: [00:11:23] Well, I wanted to believe that he was going to stay in Los Angeles. I actually thought that was probably the best situation potentially for him with Sean McVay sticking around because Sean McVay, we respect him as an offensive mind. Right. I'm a little worried for Baker in this sense. And I guess this is where I should ask is if this is truly the end of the road for Baker Mayfield, did he maximize his ability or was he just screwed from the start? Because you look at the Cleveland situation, we talked about the Freddie Kitchens era, the brief Freddie Kitchens era. Stefanski comes in, loves him one season, hates them the next. Then he goes to Carolina, which we know how fucked that situation too was. And now he's in Tampa where I mean, Tom Brady would never outwardly say it, but I think that he was so over Todd Bowles in that coaching staff after Bruce Arians was gone. And yes, that was Tom Brady's fault, don't get me wrong for pushing Arians out. But now Baker Mayfield goes to that and maybe Todd Bowles and that staff is just a bad staff at the end of the day. [00:12:25][61.8]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:12:26] So to answer the first part of your question to Baker Mayfield maximizes NFL ability. If we're thinking about his career in hindsight, I would say no part of it on him, part of it on Cleveland and the year that Freddie Kitchens was the coordinator was just sabotaged from the start for Baker Mayfield, and it stinted his growth. But the other side of that is Baker was pounding his place on the table for them to make Freddie Kitchens the offensive coordinator. So both maybe are at fault there the last season. He shouldn't have played through that injury. He should have sat around week three, sat out the season, made Cleveland have to pick whether or not they were going to keep him long term or not, because all playing through the season did was make it clear in Cleveland's head that he was not worth keeping around. He shouldn't have played that last season. And so from there, it's hard to evaluate with the rest of his career has been because he got to Carolina was so bad that they just straight up cut him like he was the third string quarterback on the Panthers who didn't have a quarterback basically to start the season and then had that run with the Rams where he was playing well, but he was playing relatively well. But it was meaningless football. I mean, the Rams were out of it from the start and. [00:13:38][72.6]
Julian Martinez: [00:13:39] Yeah, and you go back you mentioned because you mentioned the comeback effort, right, on Thursday Night Football. You even go back to that one. There was some interceptions that should have been had by the Raiders defense that just weren't interceptions. [00:13:49][10.6]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:13:50] Yeah, for sure. So no Baker Mayfield didn't maximizes NFL career, but that doesn't mean like Baker Mayfield's career is a failure, like the fact that he was the number one pick in the NFL draft and the fact that he stuck around as a starting quarterback for even five years is absolutely remarkable. Again, this dude is five foot nine without super athletic physical gifts. He was a walk on at Texas Tech. Kliff Kingsbury didn't keep him around despite the fact he won Big 12 Newcomer of the Year, filling in for I think it was post Patrick Mahomes at that point and moved to Oklahoma, wins the freakin Heisman Trophy at Oklahoma has the greatest statistical season in the history of Big 12 football, which is saying a lot because there's been some crazy statistical seasons in the Big 12 and then he gets drafted number one overall in the NFL draft and then gets all the commercials and gets to be a legend at Oklahoma forever like. But isn't that kind of incredible success. [00:14:50][59.8]
Julian Martinez: [00:14:50] Part of the problem in terms of why people look back and think of his career as a failure because he was the number one overall pick. Why would we look at his career differently if he was drafted 1510 relative to Josh Allen, Lamar, Josh Rosen, even, and Sam Darnold in that draft? [00:15:09][18.2]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:15:09] If the 2018 draft had been drafted correctly, he would have been the third quarterback in a two quarterback class. And by the way, most NFL think about it, there's like what, 16 NFL quarterbacks that are worth a damn, that are going to have ten year long careers as a starting quarterback. That means basically like 1 to 2 quarterbacks a year that's actually worth a damn gets drafted in the NFL. Like the fact that he was kind of on the fringe of like the third quarterback in a two quarterback class is still an incredible success because he doesn't have the physical. Gifts of Sam Darnold. Now, granted, Sam Darnold is going to have a better second stage of his career. But that's not for Baker Mayfield's abilities as a quarterback. It's because Baker Mayfield was an immature asshole coming out of college and never really got rid of the full, immature asshole part of the game. And, you know, there's been all sorts of immature moments that people have talked about with Baker Mayfield. [00:16:00][50.9]
Julian Martinez: [00:16:01] What was that Duke Johnson thing? Yeah, Yeah, the Duke Johnson thing. You had him calling out the training staff something about concussions or injuries or mis evaluation, whatever. [00:16:11][10.4]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:16:12] The arrest in college, where he's running away from the police, you have the grabbing, the junk thing. That is going to be one of his defining moments. You have. [00:16:18][6.8]
Julian Martinez: [00:16:19] Hugh Jackson. You know, he had that situation where you jawing at him on the sidelines. [00:16:23][4.0]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:16:24] Was that Stefanski who said they wanted an adult in the room when when they were getting ready to move off of him. That was the whole thing that they were saying. [00:16:31][7.1]
Julian Martinez: [00:16:31] Yeah, that was something that was game discussed as well. Like we want an adult in the room. And obviously when you consider what ended up happening in Cleveland too, that's also an indictment on Baker Mayfield. [00:16:42][10.4]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:16:43] Yeah. And again, he was the one who was pushing hard for Freddie Kitchens, and Jimmy Haslam believed he was the long term option at quarterback and gave him the head coach he wanted. And it was a it was the biggest failure. [00:16:52][9.9]
Julian Martinez: [00:16:53] And again, the commercials get used against him to like, again, go get your money. Sure. But like when you just have one good year in the NFL and then you come out and have like more commercials than a touchdown passes at one point, you know, that's that's a problem for NFL team. [00:17:07][14.3]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:17:07] But again, that's the reason why we're talking about will this be Baker Mayfield's last year in the NFL? It's the same thing we talked about a couple of weeks ago with Carson Wentz. It is. You have to be really well like to be a backup quarterback in the NFL. And this is the moment of Baker Mayfield's career where in his mind, he is always an underdog. And by the way, he's got good reason to believe he is always an underdog. He is a two time walk on corner rack who ended up having the greatest statistical season in college football history until Joe Burrow a couple of years later. Like he is perennially an underdog, he went to Cleveland, the ultimate city of underdogs who haven't had a franchise quarterback in 15 years. And he's the savior. He's the God complex. And it's what happens when using the haters as fuel of sorts. What happens when that underdog mentality and trying to prove everyone wrong? What happens when they're right and you're wrong and then that underdog mentality doesn't serve you anymore? That's kind of where we're at with you. Give it to. [00:18:03][55.5]
Julian Martinez: [00:18:03] Colin Cowherd, Right? He was like on Baker Mayfield from the start, as far as like what he thought of him. In fact, I'll go back to that Baker Mayfield interview on The Coward Show that was also part of like his legacy as well, like him showing up Colin after like he had a successful first year in Cleveland and now here we are. [00:18:21][18.3]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:18:22] Like I said, this this originally started with he's the third quarterback in a to quarterback class. Sam Darnold is going to have a promising career as a backup quarterback because Sam Darnold is is more likely. [00:18:32][10.1]
Julian Martinez: [00:18:32] To play devil's advocate here, though, I would say obviously and I alluded to this, but part of it is where you end up, right? Like if Josh Allen or Lamar Jackson ended up in Cleveland, how different would their careers be, especially like a guy like Josh Allen, Right. Who was considered a project, didn't look that great his first couple of years in Buffalo. But Buffalo had the right staff to work with him, develop him and make him a better quarterback. Where is Baker Mayfield's ability regressed under the coaching staff in Cleveland because his rookie year eight commits comes out sets the at the time NFL's rookie record for passing touchdowns and the second year again Baker it was Freddie kitchens but still like you mentioned Baker wanted Freddie kitchens and his ability regressed because of it. [00:19:24][51.2]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:19:24] BAKER Mayfield had two seasons as an NFL quarterback where he was he was legitimately if he could have had his first season and his third season every year of his career, he would have been Kirk Cousins if he could have done his first year and his third year every year, he would have been a couple time Pro Bowl quarterback of starter in the league for 12 years. It was the second year with Freddie Kitchens and then his body just fell apart because he played through seven different injuries in that 2020. But why? [00:19:53][29.3]
Julian Martinez: [00:19:53] Why he could never be. Kirk Cousins honestly though is going back to it. The interceptions, the turnovers, that's part of Baker Mayfield's game too, which is unfortunate because when you consider what made him so great in college, it was that he was a precision quarterback, most accurate quarterback in the game, and he just went away from that. He wanted to be the playmaker. He always thought that he was more athletic than the other guys on the field when clearly when you get in the NFL, that just doesn't translate as well. You're just not the athlete you once were, especially at the quarterback position. [00:20:25][31.8]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:20:26] Absolutely. I didn't mean Kirk Cousins in terms of like his play ability, although he could have evolved into being one of the short accuracy guys in the league. I just meant like he was an above average quarterback his first. Last year, he had 27 touchdowns, 14 interceptions and a 94 passer rating league average is about 91.6. [00:20:44][18.4]
Julian Martinez: [00:20:46] I think a good comp. [00:20:46][0.7]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:20:47] Though, pretty good. [00:20:47][0.6]
Julian Martinez: [00:20:48] Is he wanted to play like Mahomes. He wanted to play like Josh Allen. He wanted to play like Brett Favre. He wanted to be the gunslinger. And at a certain point, it's like you got to stop being the gunslinger. You kind of honestly would have been better if he played more like Tom Brady, you know, quick out of the hand, accurate. Drew Brees or any of the other ones that like we kind of think of the pick apart slice and dice in the short passing game that would have probably been playing more to his strengths. [00:21:13][25.6]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:21:14] Maybe that's where having four different offensive coordinators in three years in Cleveland probably didn't help. Right? Having four different offensive coordinators probably didn't help me out to where it was kind of the Baker Mayfield offense. But again, this is where I think his career is so interesting for so many different reasons. But I think that this is where it kind of because it's over at this point, let's let's put it there. Whether he gets the starting job in Tampa, whether he doesn't get the starting job in Tampa, it's over. People are picking Tampa to finish fourth in the NFC South this year. [00:21:43][28.9]
Julian Martinez: [00:21:43] Even if he gets the starting job right, he's probably going to lose that job at some point during the season if you had to put your money on it. If he starts week one, how long before he gets replaced in season? [00:21:53][9.1]
Kyle Ledbetter: [00:21:53] Yeah, I mean, it happened last year, right? He was the starter out the gate for the Panthers and he got what, like three games? Then he had to go in and he had to replace P.J. Walker, played like shit, and then they cut him. So like, yeah, it's basically over for Baker Mayfield at this point. It's just if he sticks around as a backup quarterback, I don't think of that as being like the legacy of Baker Mayfield. It's like he's sticking around because it's nice to be an NFL quarterback. It's fun to play football. I haven't thought about Andy Dalton's career in like four years. It's basically been signed, sealed and delivered at this point. For Andy Dalton being an impact quarterback, that's where Baker Mayfield's at at this point. So he was he's in that group of like the third tier quarterbacks in terms of careers. He didn't have a 15 year career. He didn't have a ten year career as a starter. He had about a five year career, a few years where a team was going to take a chance on him instead of a rookie. And then after this year he'll be a backup quarterback again. I mean, he was a backup quarterback last year. It's just he he chose to go to the one place that had a quarterback opening and he still might not even get the job because they'll opt for the the rookie who the young guy who's been a backup quarterback for the last two years. And I mean, either way, I mean, at the end of the day, Baker Mayfield's career is going to feel like a disappointment because he only got five years as an NFL starter. But the fact that he was even as good as he was, given the skills that he had and given the physical abilities that he had, like his career is incredible. Like his journey to get to this point is absolutely incredible. And at this point, his body has been physically broken. The underdog mentality thing doesn't work anymore because you are no longer an NFL quarterback. It doesn't serve him anymore. And I'm interested to see how he changes for the next stage of his career. [00:23:42][108.9]
Julian Martinez: [00:23:43] All right, guys. Well, that's a little bit of a retrospective currently on Baker Mayfield's career or is it a retrospective? Can you take back the reins in Tampa and win over that job? Over Kyle Trask? My dear thoughts in the comments section, we were like on the video, Subscribe to the channel, Follow us on our social media forum, Juju and I'll stay safe, happy and healthy. We will see next year. She. [00:23:43][0.0]
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